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stevethebluenose90
20-08-2011, 15:08
How long will he last?

7 years or something without a trophy and started off poorly this season.

RangersRus
20-08-2011, 15:14
It is now becoming very difficult for him. His total refusal and denial that he needs a big strong centre back has killed off his chances of trophies for a few years now,but he just keeps going with it. Now would be the time to get out,and just say it was because he had lost his better players with little chance of replacing them.

Who would replace him and do better though?

BODiE
20-08-2011, 15:15
The failure to sign a decent keeper in years should have had him the boot

Nacho Novo
20-08-2011, 15:17
They're still a young side with lots of potential :roll:

david1291
20-08-2011, 15:18
terrific mental toughness and strength

leftie
20-08-2011, 15:19
It is now becoming very difficult for him. His total refusal and denial that he needs a big strong centre back has killed off his chances of trophies for a few years now,but he just keeps going with it. Now would be the time to get out,and just say it was because he had lost his better players with little chance of replacing them.

Who would replace him and do better though?

Mourinho - he'll be getting binned by Real before the season' finished.

I think Wenger needs to leave for both him and Arsenal to progress.

A wee swap may not go amiss?

JTB
20-08-2011, 15:20
I don't know of any other manager who has rode the storm like he has.....in one hand yes you can argue he has developed an academy of fine talents coming through the ranks and if you take out of the equation the emirates stadium which cost a fortune then financially he has not spent like other clubs. Football is a game however about winning, at the same time supporters want to be entertained and to be able to boast that their team can play with elegance & be dominant.

What have Arsenal fans been able to sing about for the last 6 odd years? They have not won a trophy, even though the likes of Birmingham have been able to in that time......that is a shocking stat, the problem as well is that even after all of the money saved not spending on established players and going with youth & fairly unknown players look at them now, they look dismantled and in real danger, 0-0 with newcastle and beaten 2-0 off Liverpool in their own ground.....lack of clinical finishing, dodgy defence as ever, the midfield look weak - there just is nothing special about them at all now other than some fancy play in the first two thirds of the pitch which wins you no prizes.


He should be moved to another role within the club as some sort of loyalty bonus (if he would accept that) and a new manager brought in who I am sure could address the key issues Arsenal have had for many a year.

Drago1873
20-08-2011, 15:21
He should have got the tin tack at the end of last season

Gio Van Bronckhorst
20-08-2011, 15:42
Wenger should probably go but not in the fashion many want to see.

He won 3 league titles, 4 fa cups took them to European finals, built the greatest Arsenal side ever and his 2003/2004 side were only bettered by Sachi AC Milan and this Barcelona team for good football.

That should never be forgotten regardless of how it ends.

If he walked away at the end of the season he would leave as the greatest living figure in Arsenals history. He should be treated as such.

Sebo23
20-08-2011, 15:46
The failure to sign a decent keeper in years should have had him the boot

Keep hearing this, but the young pole they have in goals just now is class. It's too easy and lazy to throw this at him now.

Rangers2011
20-08-2011, 15:48
He will be gone this season imo.

DJ Blue
20-08-2011, 15:49
Feel sorry for him a little, because they forked out plenty for their stadium it's restricted their buying power compared to other top EPL teams.

JTB
20-08-2011, 15:50
Wenger should probably go but not in the fashion many want to see.

He won 3 league titles, 4 fa cups took them to European finals, built the greatest Arsenal side ever and his 2003/2004 side were only bettered by Sachi AC Milan and this Barcelona team for good football.

That should never be forgotten regardless of how it ends.

If he walked away at the end of the season he would leave as the greatest living figure in Arsenals history. He should be treated as such.

That's why I mentioned the loyalty new role deal......his ideas & management as well as knack in finding top players in his prime was exceptional, it has been way too long now however to let past glories deflect from the harsh reality that their club have woefully underachieved in the last 7 seasons.

sirdrinksalot
20-08-2011, 16:02
As usual they have some fantastic young players and still have some excellent first choicers - Vermaelan, Van Persie, Wilshere etc, however they are still woefully short of quality and they will struggle badly this season, unless they spend some serious money on at least 4 top additions to their side.

Gio Van Bronckhorst
20-08-2011, 16:02
That's why I mentioned the loyalty new role deal......his ideas & management as well as knack in finding top players in his prime was exceptional, it has been way too long now however to let past glories deflect from the harsh reality that their club have woefully underachieved in the last 7 seasons.

I agree with you but he should still be treated with the highest regard, he could have left for Bayern and Real Madrid when he was at his pomp and didn't. Forget what has happened in recent years he rebuilt Arsenal on and off the pitch

A generation of Arsenal fans have grown up under Wenger, the generation before that saw him transform boring boring Arsenal in to the most attractive side in the country and he is their most sucessful manager.

It would be heart breaking to see Wenger embrassed out, legends shouldn't go out like that. I remember my old man saying the same about Greig and others about Shankly and Stein.

Dazzzzo
20-08-2011, 16:06
It really is taking it a bit far now

The fans clearly want a change from the youth policy

I reckon he'll sign a couple of players to keep the fans at bay shortly...he really has to

pelem
20-08-2011, 16:08
Do not write this man off after 2 premier league games.




Get a reality check.

TheBattleFever
20-08-2011, 16:09
Arsenal looked beaten as soon as Liverpool got their opener, the morale of that squad is obviously in a bad place and to me Wengers shambolic handling of transfers in and out of the club is a major factor in this. There is the potential for things to go really badly for Arsenal in the next week, if Wenger does not significantly strengthen the squad in the time remaining in this transfer window then he is simply not fit to manage that club.

freckles1690
20-08-2011, 16:10
If Arsenal were to sack him, they wouldn't change the transfer policy set by the board, which is to be self-sustaining, as opposed to the sugar daddy model of Chelsea and Man City. I admire Arsenal's principled stance on this, but it's easy to see why fans gets frustrated. Arsenal's spending over the past decade is tiny compared to the other clubs challenging for the top four, and I'm sure Wenger would do things differently if he had a bottomless pity of money like Mancini, though even then he wouldn't spend to the same extent, for Wenger has said he fully supports the Arsenal strategy of holding down transfer fees and wages in order to avoid the mad price inflation in the EPL. Fans, of course, have different priorites and want trophies now.

I think Wenger is a great manager and nobody could do better than he has on the same budget.

snoopyboymason
20-08-2011, 16:13
He's done a tremendous job there but he must buy experieced quality players ASAP

drgriffen
20-08-2011, 16:14
I'd be surprised if they sacked him, but if they lose to Udinese and Man Utd (heavily) then the board's arm may be forced.

I love the way the play and his ethos of how to play football, but ultimately he has let dogma get in the way of practicality.

diggydoctor
20-08-2011, 18:14
I can see him resigning, saying he's taken them as far as he can etc.

Whether or not he's encouraged to leave by the board is another question. But I think they'll let him leave with some dignity and not sack him.

53easy
20-08-2011, 18:16
He should spend 50m on three English players then resign.

PartickGer
20-08-2011, 18:18
Losing to Udinese followed by a hammering at Old Trafford (both very possible) would surely leave his position untenable.

One things for sure, Sir Alex would enjoy being the man to twist the knife!

PartickGer
20-08-2011, 18:24
Losing to Udinese followed by a hammering at Old Trafford (both very possible) would surely leave his position untenable.

One things for sure, Sir Alex would enjoy being the man to twist the knife!

Leo_Ger
20-08-2011, 18:54
and his 2003/2004 side were only bettered by Sachi AC Milan and this Barcelona team for good football.


Don't deserve to be mentioned in the same breath as those two teams and countless others, even in something as subjective as "good football".

Top_Cat
20-08-2011, 18:56
He'll do well to last beyond Xmas.

gtm
20-08-2011, 19:05
I don't know if I agree with the majority in this thread. I think if he is going to go then it will be at the end of the season - he has done too much for them to be sacked during a season.

I also think the Arsenal fans will wait to see who he brings in with the Fabregas / Eboue / Nasri money before making their mind up on whether the job is beyond him now.

The ironic thing for me is that he let Bartley up here on loan last season and this when the big man is exactly what he needs to solve one of his two biggest issues (the other being the keeper).

MathewWasHere
20-08-2011, 19:08
He will never get sacked and he just said he would never walk

Needs to sign a couple players now!

Top_Cat
20-08-2011, 19:10
He will never get sacked and he just said he would never walk

Needs to sign a couple players now!

You sure?
When 50k odd fans start to boo week in/week out, the trigger will get pulled.
He needs to win something this year, or it will be his last.

uml
20-08-2011, 19:11
Don't deserve to be mentioned in the same breath as those two teams and countless others, even in something as subjective as "good football".

Rubbish, You've obviously never watched that team.
Wenger has been an expectional manager for the EPL. Not sure why in the last few years he has been unable to put that steel in his midfield and defence that he had with the likes of Viera and Keown in the past.

Still an absolutely outstanding manager and his teams always great to watch.

MathewWasHere
20-08-2011, 19:19
You sure?
When 50k odd fans start to boo week in/week out, the trigger will get pulled.
He needs to win something this year, or it will be his last.

This has been happening for a couple of seasons now

he is still at Arsenal

Top_Cat
20-08-2011, 19:21
This has been happening for a couple of seasons now

he is still at Arsenal

I didn't know this mate.

I do still think that unless he delivers this season, it will be his last.

Leo_Ger
20-08-2011, 19:24
Rubbish, You've obviously never watched that team.

Yes, I've obviously never watched that team from 7 years ago.

I watched them draw against the likes of Leicester City, Fulham, Bolton Wanderers, Everton, Newcastle United and Portsmouth in mundane affairs and lose against Chelsea, Manchester United, Inter Milan, Dynamo Kiev and Middlesbrough.

Sam_English
20-08-2011, 19:24
Wenger seems to be 'bomb-proof' when it comes to picking up his p45.
Any other manager would've been out the door by now.

MathewWasHere
20-08-2011, 19:25
I didn't know this mate.

I do still think that unless he delivers this season, it will be his last.

Yeah probably mate

it would be seven seasons without a trophy

blutos
20-08-2011, 19:40
If Arsenal were to sack him, they wouldn't change the transfer policy set by the board, which is to be self-sustaining, as opposed to the sugar daddy model of Chelsea and Man City. I admire Arsenal's principled stance on this, but it's easy to see why fans gets frustrated. Arsenal's spending over the past decade is tiny compared to the other clubs challenging for the top four, and I'm sure Wenger would do things differently if he had a bottomless pity of money like Mancini, though even then he wouldn't spend to the same extent, for Wenger has said he fully supports the Arsenal strategy of holding down transfer fees and wages in order to avoid the mad price inflation in the EPL. Fans, of course, have different priorites and want trophies now.

I think Wenger is a great manager and nobody could do better than he has on the same budget.
He just spent 15 million on a teenager from League One, in addition to 8.5mil on Koscielny and 3.5 on Squillaci last year. 5 million on Ramsey, 10 million on Gervinho, 15 million on Arshavin...

The myth that Wenger has no money has to stop. He's just seems generally bad at trusting which of his scouts to use.

Earl of Leven
20-08-2011, 19:46
As I said a few weeks back....buy Inkoom, Cahill, Parker and perhaps someone up front who isn't a diving gaylord.

They should have bought Mata also.

Buddiebearette
20-08-2011, 19:54
maybe times will change and more banks will call in the debt... The Gunners will be sitting pretty when that happens. Arsenal are not millions in the red where as so many other clubs succeed by going into massive debt to buy better players....

whos_the_dado
20-08-2011, 21:09
maybe times will change and more banks will call in the debt... The Gunners will be sitting pretty when that happens. Arsenal are not millions in the red where as so many other clubs succeed by going into massive debt to buy better players....

Arsenal are millions in debt, hundreds allegedly due to their super duper stadium over 400m i believe it was, i heard they stil owe 240m.

Helstead
20-08-2011, 21:19
Arsenal do have some quality players but it seems they lack a backbone and someone to really take control of the players on the park.
In the past they had Adams and players of that calibre that had passion,nowadays its Arshavin complaining about wages..van pierse looking lost..and no real midfield or keeper.
I know Wenger says he buys for the future with the youngsters but you hes needs to also buy for the present.

crackout
20-08-2011, 21:39
He just spent 15 million on a teenager from League One, in addition to 8.5mil on Koscielny and 3.5 on Squillaci last year. 5 million on Ramsey, 10 million on Gervinho, 15 million on Arshavin...

The myth that Wenger has no money has to stop. He's just seems generally bad at trusting which of his scouts to use.

I am no fan of Wenger, in fact I think he deserved the sack a while ago. He is nowhere near the "outstanding manager" that another poster claims.

However, it is no myth that he hasn't had the transfer funds. Since the summer of 07/08 he as spent just over £90m. Compare that to any other EPL side that has any remote chance of a Champions League spot...

£450m+ Manchester City
£200m+ Spurs
£215m+ Chelsea
£260m+ Liverpool
£165m+ Manchester United

I'm not defending him, he hasn't addressed the glaring problems within his squads over the years. However, he isn't getting close to the funding of the teams that he is being expected to compete with.

wronglypenalised
20-08-2011, 21:48
I think a bit of reality checking is needed as far as this season goes. He has Vermaelen back fit who is an experienced and quality CB, they drew last week away to Newcastle with a man down (and a clean sheet) won during the week with another clean sheet, and up until an OG today were not looking likely (imo) of conceding. It's only when you see things like the og going in and coupled with the rejigged back 4 that the team then looks like (and did) concede another which inevitably happens when any team tries to chase the game being a man down.

I think once the injuries and suspensions settle down (and assuming that they stay at a reasonable level - after all it's not like they are going to see a man sent off in every game) then I think they could make a challenge.

blutos
20-08-2011, 21:52
I am no fan of Wenger, in fact I think he deserved the sack a while ago. He is nowhere near the "outstanding manager" that another poster claims.

However, it is no myth that he hasn't had the transfer funds. Since the summer of 07/08 he as spent just over £90m. Compare that to any other EPL side that has any remote chance of a Champions League spot...

£450m+ Manchester City
£200m+ Spurs
£215m+ Chelsea
£260m+ Liverpool
£165m+ Manchester United

I'm not defending him, he hasn't addressed the glaring problems within his squads over the years. However, he isn't getting close to the funding of the teams that he is being expected to compete with.
If that is the circumstance, do you not reckon the 15 million he's spent on Oxlade-Chamberlain to be a bit silly given that he has limited funds?

SpongebobSquarePass
20-08-2011, 22:00
Going against the grain on here he is an outstanding manager and Arsenal would be off their heads to get rid of him.

1) He's up against an incredible standard of opposition compared with previously
2) Vermaelen was injured for ages and he was an excellent centre half
3) Those fans get entertained beyond what they'd get with almost any other manager
4) They have big repayments on the stadium and haven't spent the money that Man U, Man C, Chelsea and Liverpool have.
5) He's brought through young talent time after time after time.
6) He's a great coach not just a cheque book manager
7) Who exactly is going to be better than him that would want the Arsenal job?

If they do sack him or remove him I'd give it a fortnight before they wish they hadn't.

Arsenal fans need to get a grip. If it wasn't for Wenger they might not be playing Barcelona never mind getting beat by them.

crackout
20-08-2011, 22:47
If that is the circumstance, do you not reckon the 15 million he's spent on Oxlade-Chamberlain to be a bit silly given that he has limited funds?

As I said, I'm not defending him. He deserves the sack because he either doesn't see the problems within his squad or is too stubborn to sign the necessary players.

However, he might view it that his current policy is keeping them in the Champions League every year and filling the stadium, and therefore putting the club in a strong financial position. If he went out and spent his entire £25m on a player that didn't work then they could be in bother. That is probably why he has kept his job.

Jim Baxter is legend
20-08-2011, 22:51
who is going to sack him?

the board loves him, he is selling players gfor big money that is what the board want

ThePedroandMaryChain
20-08-2011, 22:57
He tries too hard to be clever. He should be going out and buying established players to fit right into the spine of the first team rather than paying £3-10m (peanuts for a team with CL aspirations) for relative unknowns in the hope that they come good and win him an arselicking from the media.

KilwinningBlue
20-08-2011, 22:57
Do not write this man off after 2 premier league games.




Get a reality check.

What about after 6 years? :roll:

david1982
20-08-2011, 22:59
Alan Hansen, despite being a bell end, on MOTD is right, if they get pumped on Wednesday in Italy, pumped off Man Utd next Sunday and dont sign any players before the window closes it will be armageddon and a real cross roads on how they go forward

david1982
20-08-2011, 23:01
He tries too hard to be clever. He should be going out and buying established players to fit right into the spine of the first team rather than paying £3-10m (peanuts for a team with CL aspirations) for relative unknowns in the hope that they come good and win him an arselicking from the media.

They have been screaming out for a top class holding player since Gilberto left 4 years ago

They also need another striker as Gervinho is unproven, Chamakh is mince and Van Persie is constantly injured

KilwinningBlue
20-08-2011, 23:05
A big part of the problem is the fans, they have been silent for too long. A more boring, unenthused (sp) crowd you would find hard to come across.

bilkobear
20-08-2011, 23:07
I don't know of any other manager who has rode the storm like he has.....in one hand yes you can argue he has developed an academy of fine talents coming through the ranks and if you take out of the equation the emirates stadium which cost a fortune then financially he has not spent like other clubs. Football is a game however about winning, at the same time supporters want to be entertained and to be able to boast that their team can play with elegance & be dominant.

What have Arsenal fans been able to sing about for the last 6 odd years? They have not won a trophy, even though the likes of Birmingham have been able to in that time......that is a shocking stat, the problem as well is that even after all of the money saved not spending on established players and going with youth & fairly unknown players look at them now, they look dismantled and in real danger, 0-0 with newcastle and beaten 2-0 off Liverpool in their own ground.....lack of clinical finishing, dodgy defence as ever, the midfield look weak - there just is nothing special about them at all now other than some fancy play in the first two thirds of the pitch which wins you no prizes.


He should be moved to another role within the club as some sort of loyalty bonus (if he would accept that) and a new manager brought in who I am sure could address the key issues Arsenal have had for many a year.


Time catches up with every man in almost any job.

However, Arsene Wenger is the father of the modern game in my opinion.

He is the template for a team like Barcelona, where the dream is to put eleven footballers into a team, keep the ball on the deck and play football like the Gods meant it to be played.

AW almost got there.
Although he refused and probably never had the money to see this realised, he nonetheless stayed more or less true to the concept.

It is not an easy concept, and men like Clough had to compromise it due to the lack of being able to get the top eleven technical players for the usual reasons, such as economic and geographical.
These reasons don't exist for some teams anymore and thus we have Barcelona, a concept of the very best in the world, with a very strong Spanish base.

Arsene Wenger has been the single reason for Arsenal building a new and amazing stadium without becoming another debt casualty.
That he did all of that whilst keeping them at the top of the football pyramid is beyond belief.

He is a modern hero of football for anyone who cares about football.

What happens in the dog eat dog world of modern debased soccer will never take any of that away from him.

As for me, I am no real fan of Arsenal.

KilwinningBlue
20-08-2011, 23:10
Time catches up with every man in almost any job.

However, Arsene Wenger is the father of the modern game in my opinion.

He is the template for a team like Barcelona, where the dream is to put eleven footballers into a team, keep the ball on the deck and play football like the Gods meant it to be played.

AW almost got there.
However no matter that he never spent the money, he stayed more or less true to the concept.

It is not an easy concept, and men like Clough had to compromise it due to the lack of being able to get the top eleven technical players for the usual reasons, such as economic and geographical.
These reasons don't exist for some teams anymore and thus we have Barcelona, a concept of the very best in the world, with a very strong Spanish base.

Arsene Wenger has been the single reason for Arsenal building a new and amazing stadium without becoming another debt casualty.
That he did all of that whilst keeping them at the top of the football pyramid is beyond belief.

He is a modern hero of football for anyone who cares about football.

What happens in the dog eat dog world of modern debased soccer will never take any of that away from him.

As for me, I am no real fan of Arsenal.

He is a whinging ****, I am no real fan of Arsene :D

bilkobear
20-08-2011, 23:13
He is a whinging ****, I am no real fan of Arsene :D

If he ever left Arsenal I would give him a huge salary and put him in charge of the entire football structure of Scotland.

I would do it in a moment and never regret it.

Your one line comment somehow never convinced me of anything other than that you are no fan of Arsene.

Funny that....eh?

david1982
20-08-2011, 23:15
Time catches up with every man in almost any job.

However, Arsene Wenger is the father of the modern game in my opinion.

He is the template for a team like Barcelona, where the dream is to put eleven footballers into a team, keep the ball on the deck and play football like the Gods meant it to be played.

AW almost got there.
Although he refused and probably never had the money to see this realised, he nonetheless stayed more or less true to the concept.

It is not an easy concept, and men like Clough had to compromise it due to the lack of being able to get the top eleven technical players for the usual reasons, such as economic and geographical.
These reasons don't exist for some teams anymore and thus we have Barcelona, a concept of the very best in the world, with a very strong Spanish base.

Arsene Wenger has been the single reason for Arsenal building a new and amazing stadium without becoming another debt casualty.
That he did all of that whilst keeping them at the top of the football pyramid is beyond belief.

He is a modern hero of football for anyone who cares about football.

What happens in the dog eat dog world of modern debased soccer will never take any of that away from him.

As for me, I am no real fan of Arsenal.


Good post, i like Wengers attitude to playing football, who wouldnt? However in the days of foreign owners ploughing hundreds of millions of pounds in success is demanded, not hoped for.

Arsenals supporters are a weird lot, in recent years they have backed Wenger to the hilt and that is to be admired, one or two on here, including myself, could probably take a leaf from their book i suppose.

How long though will they put up with not winning a thing and watching them fall further behind the 2 manchester clubs and chelsea? Today at the Emirates they were dominated for posession by a Liverpool side with 5 new players signed within the last 6 months, i made a point earlier that if they go out the CL on wed and take a beating at old trafford next weekend it will be interesting to see the reaction.

bilkobear
20-08-2011, 23:19
Good post, i like Wengers attitude to playing football, who wouldnt? However in the days of foreign owners ploughing hundreds of millions of pounds in success is demanded, not hoped for.

Arsenals supporters are a weird lot, in recent years they have backed Wenger to the hilt and that is to be admired, one or two on here, including myself, could probably take a leaf from their book i suppose.

How long though will they put up with not winning a thing and watching them fall further behind the 2 manchester clubs and chelsea? Today at the Emirates they were dominated by for posession by a Liverpool side with 5 new players signed within the last 6 months, i made a point earlier that if they go out the CL on wed and take a beating at old trafford next weekend it will be interesting to see the reaction.

I agree.
I think his time at Arsenal is coming to an end.
Nothing lasts forever.
He needs a new challenge, and maybe it should be one with a larger remit.

I would give him the Scotland job.
Give him complete executive power over every aspect of Scottish football from the playing side, top to bottom.
Then let us see what he does with it.

What have we got to lose?

mr.david
20-08-2011, 23:21
Alot of people defending an Arsenal manager thats not won anything in 7 years and the same people are them are already calling for McCoists head after 6 games :mad:

Virgil Hilts
20-08-2011, 23:27
I have a feeling if Kombouaré does not deliver early at PSG, Leonardo will try to tempt him to the Parc des Princes, giving him an face saving route out of the Emirates

david1982
20-08-2011, 23:33
I have a feeling if Kombouaré does not deliver early at PSG, Leonardo will try to tempt him to the Parc des Princes, giving him an face saving route out of the Emirates

Would the same problem not exist at PSG though where he is reluctant to spend money and given they have just been bought over by someone with money would their fans take that?

My own hunch is he will chuck management after Arsenal and work as the French FA Technical Director or their Head of Youth

Leo_Ger
20-08-2011, 23:36
However, Arsene Wenger is the father of the modern game in my opinion.

He is the template for a team like Barcelona, where the dream is to put eleven footballers into a team, keep the ball on the deck and play football like the Gods meant it to be played.


A bunch of Dutch guys came up with what is listed around four decades ago. Its greatest exponent is the father of the modern Barcelona.

bigkahunarab
20-08-2011, 23:44
His time may be close, probably through a run of bad luck yet leaving behind the basis of a decent team. Needs a C/B though.

bilkobear
20-08-2011, 23:51
A bunch of Dutch guys came up with what is listed around four decades ago. It's greatest exponent is the father of the modern Barcelona.

Maybe.
But some would say that the Brazil of 1970 played the same game that Johan Cryuff would take to a different level in the club game in Europe.

However, the modern game has no restraints on nationality, geography nor money in putting forward a football team.
You are, as a coach at a top team, left to your own naked vision.

We see Mourinho's and we wince but respect his ability to win.
We see Pep Guardiola's and we are enchanted.

However we could easily say that JC was merely a result of Rinus Michels and that Michels a result of the great Hungarian team of the fifties and so on.

Every development in football has a reason and a particular cultural element to its appearance, and for me Wenger is the standout modern coach who has fathered the emphasis on a new and more skill based total football, if we may call it such.

He perhaps just hasn't coached at the right team in the right country to reap the whirlwind of his own initiated wind.

adelblue
20-08-2011, 23:52
He has a real look of a broken man about him.

le great white tadpo
20-08-2011, 23:55
I don't know of any other manager who has rode the storm like he has.....in one hand yes you can argue he has developed an academy of fine talents coming through the ranks and if you take out of the equation the emirates stadium which cost a fortune then financially he has not spent like other clubs. Football is a game however about winning, at the same time supporters want to be entertained and to be able to boast that their team can play with elegance & be dominant.

What have Arsenal fans been able to sing about for the last 6 odd years? They have not won a trophy, even though the likes of Birmingham have been able to in that time......that is a shocking stat, the problem as well is that even after all of the money saved not spending on established players and going with youth & fairly unknown players look at them now, they look dismantled and in real danger, 0-0 with newcastle and beaten 2-0 off Liverpool in their own ground.....lack of clinical finishing, dodgy defence as ever, the midfield
look weak - there just is nothing special about them at all now other than some fancy play in the first two thirds of the pitch which wins you no prizes.


He should be moved to another role within the club as some sort of loyalty bonus (if he would accept that) and a new manager brought in who I am sure could address the key issues Arsenal have had for many a year.

I would take him at ibrox in a heartbeat

mrgeebus
21-08-2011, 00:05
Given the state of the economy, falling revenues and the rulings that the banks are starting to call in football debt (see the thread about Everton), also if you add in the impending fallout for Murdoch (and subsequently Sky), when the EPL bubble bursts and the yanks and Arabs stop pouring money in, then Arsenal are in the best position of any of the top clubs.

They have a conveyor belt of talent, on a fraction of the wages of the other clubs, and in 2010 cut their debt by £129m.

I would suggest that this year that figure will fall further.

david1982
21-08-2011, 00:29
Given the state of the economy, falling revenues and the rulings that the banks are starting to call in football debt (see the thread about Everton), also if you add in the impending fallout for Murdoch (and subsequently Sky), when the EPL bubble bursts and the yanks and Arabs stop pouring money in, then Arsenal are in the best position of any of the top clubs.

They have a conveyor belt of talent, on a fraction of the wages of the other clubs, and in 2010 cut their debt by £129m.

I would suggest that this year that figure will fall further.

So Arsenals message to their fans, some of whom pay 1k for a season ticket, is that they will be ok when the EPL goes tits up?

If you asked 100 of them 5 years ago whether they wanted to see their club competing properly in their own league and europe or moving away from Highbury i know what 99 of them would have said.

The new stadium and debt reduction message is wearing thin, the straw is coming that will break the camels back, and its coming soon imo.

Renoranger
21-08-2011, 01:30
Wenger should probably go but not in the fashion many want to see.

He won 3 league titles, 4 fa cups took them to European finals, built the greatest Arsenal side ever and his 2003/2004 side were only bettered by Sachi AC Milan and this Barcelona team for good football.

That should never be forgotten regardless of how it ends.

If he walked away at the end of the season he would leave as the greatest living figure in Arsenals history. He should be treated as such.

Magnificent post, sadly there are many young posters on here who do not know their history. Wenger is a superb manager, develops incredible talent, has won many times, reached many finals and his fiscal policy is second to none in the history of football. Was even in a final last season.
Many of his critics on here believe Barcelona were always in the EC final, the Mancs never had a 25 year approx dry spell, don't realize Chelsea went almost 50 years without a league title and Liverpool have not been champions for around 20 years now.
He is going through a bad patch, has lost some good players and one exceptional player in Cesc. They will progress as the season goes on and he will steady the ship. Difficult CL match during the week and it will not be easy to qualify. Wenger will see them through.
If I had the wealth of Bill Gates, he would be at Ibrox pronto.

Ted Striker
21-08-2011, 08:48
I've watched some sublime performances from Arsenal over the years thanks to Wenger. Beautiful artistic football, teams taken completely apart - passed off the park.
It's a difficult style of play to maintain in the Premiership. For me Wenger never found the balance that is so well understood by SAF. Arsenal never ground out results, never had the battle fever mentality & never had the mental toughness to consistently win trophies. He never replaced the guys who won him titles like for like. There's never been another Viera, Adams or Henry.

Wenger is a hard person to like - a whinging baby who never condemns his dirty sly players. Poor performances are everyone else's fault and shocking tackles are never seen. I don't like him & enjoy seeing Arsenal lose for that reason however he is a phenomenal talent and still has my utmost respect.

paul bryson
21-08-2011, 08:59
total respect for what he s trying to do arsenal fans will realise when he s gone the grass isnt always greener feel sorry for the guy

Sebo23
21-08-2011, 20:34
Just seen this on an Arsenal website. It's one of those unknown sources type threads, but a lot of it does make sense. It would certainly explain a lot of Wengers somewhat crazy actions recently.

It's certainly a fact that Arsenal's transfer budget includes wages & contract extensions etc, similar to the model we use now. It's also widely accepted that Arsene didn't have money to spend a few years ago despite the borad saying he did.


According to an unnamed source Arsène Wenger is at loggerheads with the Board over how the transfer budget should be spent. I am not at liberty to name that source, but I believe the information I received explains the current impasse at Arsenal. Before I explain what the differences between them are, let me make it clear that there is a substantial transfer budget that has to not only cover transfer fees but wages of incoming players and contract improvements of those already here.

The Board and Wenger are both in agreement that , to avoid the situation the club has encountered with Clichy and Nasri this summer, star men like Van Persie and Vermaelen and others with only two years left on their contract need to be offered new long term contracts with big pay rises.

And this is where the first difference of opinion has arisen between manager and club, The Board believe that offering to rise a players wage from £60K - £70K a week to £90K or £100K is more than enough, but Wenger believes that this is not enough, when City, Utd and Chelsea are paying their best(£180K - £250K), and that if we want to keep our best players we have to go to the next level, he wants the pay scale risen to £150K for our best.

This brings us neatly on to the next bone of contention between manager and club, the calibre of signing we can make. Both Wenger and the Board agree that to even maintain a top four spot, let alone win the title, several new signings are required.

The Board are willing to pay big transfer fees, as is Wenger (he is not lying when he says he would pay £30M - £40M), it is also where the difference of opinion comes. The Board would willingly meet the transfer fee, but will not meet the sort of wage demands a £30M signings asks for.

Wenger had a four pronged squad plan this summer,

Keep our best players
Buy in top level players to improve the team
Sign young players with big potential
Promote from within

Wenger has done parts 3 and 4. He wanted to do part 1 and 2 by Nasri being offered a massive contract so he would stay, and he hoped to persuade Cesc to stay one more year, with not only a new contract but with the calibre of player he signed. Wenger wanted Mata and Benzema, he still wants Hazzard, wages more than anything else are ruling out Mata and Benzema.

The Board had no problem meeting the Juan Mata transfer fee, but once Chelsea let it be known to his agents what they would offer, it blew Arsenal’s contract offer out of the water. We ran into the same situation with Jones and Utd.

People ask why have Arsenal not signed Cahill, Dann or Samba etc, well its simple really, Wenger wants better players, the Board want him to sign the above level of player, as it sits with their wage scale, Arsène wants the next level up, a Subotic, a Hummells, but they come with not only high transfer fees but with massive wage demands.

Wenger would rather not sign a player at all, than sign someone for a big fee who he considers no better than what we have, the board have asked him to reconsider this stance, and that is why Cahill and Dann have been scouted this late in the window, Arsène sees them as not as good as Koscielny, and thinks it is the wrong way to use his budget, he wants better quality for the first 11, the board just want him to make signings to appease the fans.

Wenger had a major discussion with Kroenke and the Board on Members day. He was told in no uncertain terms that Nasri would have to be sold if he did not sign a contract, and between them they came to the decision to let Cesc go for less than his worth. But Wenger fought his corner, and made it clear the sort of player he wants and that our star men have to be given contract that will keep them, as you can not build if every year there is doubts who are staying and who are going. Arsène also reiterated his view that we need top quality players, not just one as good or possibly slightly better, and that these players come at a premium cost and that the club has to go up a level not only on fees but on wages.

Arsène Wenger is a company man, and will not come out with any of this, while under contract, no matter how much flack he takes, and that is why his comments in the media, since the Members day meeting, have been more for the ears of Stan and Ivan than for the fans, he is warning them. He wont’ walk, and it will cost the club dear to sack him, and even more to shut him up if he is sacked, if they thought the deal David Dein struck with Bruce Rioch to keep him quiet was expensive, they will be blown away by what it will take to buy Arsène Wenger’s silence.

Who wins this battle of wills may define not only what happens to Arsenal’s season, but for many seasons to come.


Maybe Wenger isn't going crazy after all?

53easy
21-08-2011, 20:47
Arsenal wage bill is one of the biggest in the EPL.......Why not give a guy like say Mata a 110k then pay two players Eboue and Bendtner that wage?

The dross in their squad must get paid a fortune.

VelvetUnderground
21-08-2011, 20:56
I think he just never replaced the great players they had at the time when they were winning things, never got another Henry, Bergkamp, Pires, Big Gay Freddie, Viera etc

The likes of Arshavin, Van Persie, Bendtner and the like, just aren't as good

Sebo23
21-08-2011, 20:56
Arsenal wage bill is one of the biggest in the EPL.......Why not give a guy like say Mata a 110k then pay two players Eboue and Bendtner that wage?

The dross in their squad must get paid a fortune.

Yep, that's one of the main gripes. They don't pay the top top wages to players, but they do pay their underachieving squad players very well. That's why try as he has this summer, the likes of Almunia, Bendtner etc are still there

KilwinningBlue
21-08-2011, 21:06
If he ever left Arsenal I would give him a huge salary and put him in charge of the entire football structure of Scotland.

I would do it in a moment and never regret it.

Your one line comment somehow never convinced me of anything other than that you are no fan of Arsene.

Funny that....eh?

It wasn't meant to convince you of anything.