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View Full Version : Our transfers: Where are our cheaper alternatives?



BdTS
23-07-2011, 15:18
Ok, so we know why some people don't want Miller back, and Bursa want twice what they paid for him.

Ally says that it wouldn't make good business sense to pay 900k for him......so where is the cheaper alternative who he knows is capable of scoring 25+ a season?

We seem to be, if some on here are to be believed, holding out for Goodwillie. He'd cost around 2m...can we not do any better for that money given the baggage he will bring?

We've championed wise spending of our cash yet ended up paying 5 times our original bid for Wallace, who I feel will be a good signing, but left back was nothing close to a problem area going into today.

Secondly, Ortiz looks a hand player as well, but in my opinion he's a full-back, never a winger in a month of Sundays.

We've strengthened two areas that were nothing close to a priority in my opinion and resisted bringing in a guy proven to be capable of scoring 25+ goals a season in the SPL for the sake of a few hundred thousand.

WE're watching thre cnetre-backs by the sounds of it, but we don't seem to have alternatives for the forward positions.

Isn't it false economy to be watching the pennies when we're depriving ourselves rather than spending the cash on cheaper alternatives?

GingerFurball
23-07-2011, 15:24
You're going to have to explain your assertion that Miller is a proven 25 goal a season player.

BdTS
23-07-2011, 15:26
You're going to have to explain your assertion that Miller is a proven 25 goal a season player.

Not to anyone who isn't being pedantic, I won't.

LostSoulForever 2
23-07-2011, 15:27
Not to anyone who isn't being pedantic, I won't.

He's done it once.

crackout
23-07-2011, 15:28
Ally says that it wouldn't make good business sense to pay 900k for him......so where is the cheaper alternative who he knows is capable of scoring 25+ a season?

We seem to be, if some on here are to be believed, holding out for Goodwillie. He'd cost around 2m...can we not do any better for that money given the baggage he will bring?

:confused:

Who is the "cheaper" alternative? You answer that in your next paragraph... Goodwillie.

As for Wallace, our bidding process for him is too bizarre to understand properly. The only thing I can assume is that we tried to get him cheap, then went after other targets who all fell through, so had no choice but to significantly increase our offer for him.

LostSoulForever 2
23-07-2011, 15:28
Secondly, Ortiz looks a hand player as well, but in my opinion he's a full-back, never a winger in a month of Sundays.

Based on one game? Are you a scout?

scabrag
23-07-2011, 15:30
We shouldn't get hung up on how much we sold KM for, that was part of the mess CW is hopefully getting us out of. 900,000 isn't that much for a player who can slot straight in and solve a problem IMO.

BdTS
23-07-2011, 15:34
Based on one game? Are you a scout?

Time will tell obviously, but I don't think he has the pace for it going forward.

He tracked back well, still think he'd be a better fullback.

BdTS
23-07-2011, 15:35
We shouldn't get hung up on how much we sold KM for, that was part of the mess CW is hopefully getting us out of. 900,000 isn't that much for a player who can slot straight in and solve a problem IMO.

^^^^^^^^^

This.

If the club don't have any better value alternatives, I'm quite comfortable to cough up for him.

BadAssBear
23-07-2011, 15:36
We shouldn't get hung up on how much we sold KM for, that was part of the mess CW is hopefully getting us out of. 900,000 isn't that much for a player who can slot straight in and solve a problem IMO.

and no point saying he has no sell on value... that shouldnt come into it

get him signed

Manchester Bear_1872
23-07-2011, 15:36
^^^^^^^^^

This.

If the club don't have any better value alternatives, I'm quite comfortable to cough up for him.

Are you paying? :D

BdTS
23-07-2011, 15:39
and no point saying he has no sell on value... that shouldnt come into it

get him signed

Ortiz may not have a sell-on value.

Cuellar isn't likely to have one.

False economy from the club imo.

coplandrearl36
23-07-2011, 15:40
Based on one game? Are you a scout?

No he's Running Wylde....

He needs extra usernames to get his points across.

Hajduk Split
23-07-2011, 15:51
we need a someone who can play on the left , as I have stated before I think Semir Stilic would be a good purchase . Young , bags of potential , can create something out of nothing and also he plays in Poland we could buy him for peanuts .

BdTS
23-07-2011, 15:52
No he's Running Wylde....

He needs extra usernames to get his points across.

I don't.

I needed to avoid trolls, much like yourself.

bigbluebroxi
23-07-2011, 16:13
^^^^^^^^^

This.

If the club don't have any better value alternatives, I'm quite comfortable to cough up for him.

Nobody said the alternative had to be cheaper.

I agree, paying 900k for soon to be 32 year we sold for 400k 6 months ago is not good value.

Signing the 23 year old two time scottish young player of the year for 2m is good value.

Value isnt all about how much something is. Its about what you get for your money.

With Miller we get a guy who is inconsistent in front of goal, and whos main asset is his pace, however he struggles with niggles to his hamstrings and also suffered from shin splits, and may still do. Just under 1m is not good value, especially when he will command a high wage.

Spending a bit more on a young proven spl goalscorer, who will be on half the wages miller is, with potential sell on value is value for money.

Only using Goodwillie as an example, not saying it definitely has to be him who is the alternative, but you get the picture.

BdTS
23-07-2011, 16:15
Nobody said the alternative had to be cheaper.

I agree, paying 900k for soon to be 32 year we sold for 400k 6 months ago is not good value.

Signing the 23 year old two time scottish young player of the year for 2m is good value.

Value isnt all about how much something is. Its about what you get for your money.

With Miller we get a guy who is inconsistent in front of goal, and whos main asset is his pace, however he struggles with niggles to his hamstrings and also suffered from shin splits, and may still do. Just under 1m is not good value, especially when he will command a high wage.

Spending a bit more on a young proven spl goalscorer, who will be on half the wages miller is, with potential sell on value is value for money.

Only using Goodwillie as an example, not saying it definitely has to be him who is the alternative, but you get the picture.


Goodwillie is another one....we're going without in an effort to hold out for him due to his court case.

Is there no-one else?

bigbluebroxi
23-07-2011, 16:18
Goodwillie is another one....we're going without in an effort to hold out for him due to his court case.

Is there no-one else?

Maybe a striker is one of the deals we are working on.

MasterC
23-07-2011, 16:33
If Rangers are "waiting for Goodwillie" and willing to pay 2m if his rape charges are dropped I think that is madness.

He played a total of 43 competitive games for Dundee Utd last season and scored 18 goals (according to the internet). Now I know he would score more up front for Rangers, and alongside Jelavic, however it's hardly a brilliant record to base spending 2m on. Certainly not worth hanging about waiting for him in the hope he will get cleared.

Quite frankly Kenny Miller at half the price is a better bet. Use the extra money to pay Miller's wages. I'm not saying Miller is ideal, but to me and at the price he is a better option than Goodwillie.

BdTS
23-07-2011, 16:35
If Rangers are "waiting for Goodwillie" and willing to pay 2m if his rape charges are dropped I think that is madness.

He played a total of 43 competitive games for Dundee Utd last season and scored 18 goals (according to the internet). Now I know he would score more up front for Rangers, and alongside Jelavic, however it's hardly a brilliant record to base spending 2m on. Certainly not worth hanging about waiting for him in the hope he will get cleared.

Quite frankly Kenny Miller at half the price is a better bet. Use the extra money to pay Miller's wages. I'm not saying Miller is ideal, but to me and at the price he is a better option than Goodwillie.

Agreed.

He's a far better player than Goodwillie right now. DG's potential is tempered somewhat by his baggage.

GingerFurball
23-07-2011, 16:42
If Rangers are "waiting for Goodwillie" and willing to pay 2m if his rape charges are dropped I think that is madness.

He played a total of 43 competitive games for Dundee Utd last season and scored 18 goals (according to the internet). Now I know he would score more up front for Rangers, and alongside Jelavic, however it's hardly a brilliant record to base spending 2m on. Certainly not worth hanging about waiting for him in the hope he will get cleared.

Quite frankly Kenny Miller at half the price is a better bet. Use the extra money to pay Miller's wages. I'm not saying Miller is ideal, but to me and at the price he is a better option than Goodwillie.

Goodwillie has a better career record than Jelavic did before he came to Scotland. Goodwillie's career record also compares quite favourably with Kris Boyd's at the age of 21.

With Miller it's not just the transfer fee, it's 1m a year in wages for 3 years. That's crazy for a player who has had 12 years worth of patchy goalscoring form in his career.

MasterC
23-07-2011, 16:49
Goodwillie has a better career record than Jelavic did before he came to Scotland. Goodwillie's career record also compares quite favourably with Kris Boyd's at the age of 21.

With Miller it's not just the transfer fee, it's 1m a year in wages for 3 years. That's crazy for a player who has had 12 years worth of patchy goalscoring form in his career.

In 2009 /2010 Jelavic scored 28 goals in 48 matches for Rapid.

At the start of 2010 / 2011 he scored 5 in 7 for them.

I would say that was better than 18 in 43 in Scotland.

(Again figures taken from the internet).

MasterC
23-07-2011, 16:50
Oh and I'm not saying Miller is option, I just think that he is the better if it's between him and Goodwillie.

GingerFurball
23-07-2011, 16:56
In 2009 /2010 Jelavic scored 28 goals in 48 matches for Rapid.

At the start of 2010 / 2011 he scored 5 in 7 for them.

I would say that was better than 18 in 43 in Scotland.

(Again figures taken from the internet).

Talking overall career records.

LostSoulForever 2
23-07-2011, 17:03
Goodwillie is another one....we're going without in an effort to hold out for him due to his court case.

Is there no-one else?

Or rather, you think we are.

crackout
23-07-2011, 17:03
In 2009 /2010 Jelavic scored 28 goals in 48 matches for Rapid.

At the start of 2010 / 2011 he scored 5 in 7 for them.

I would say that was better than 18 in 43 in Scotland.

(Again figures taken from the internet).

In senior league games Jelavic had scored 36 goals in 128 games. Goodwillie has 29 in 116 games and is 3 years younger. You also exclude the fact that Goodwillie lead the SPL in assists last year.

The Croatian, Belgian and Austrian Leagues aren't exactly some of the best Leagues in Europe either. So let's not argue that Jelavic was having to do it in considerably tougher leagues.

Now what we paid for Jelavic was over twice what it is likely to cost for Goodwillie. You must have utterly hated the Jelavic signing if you were looking at the numbers the way you choose to look at Goodwillie's record...

MasterC
23-07-2011, 17:09
I chose not to look at the previous season as Goodwillie had scored 13 goals in 40 appearances. That seemed a bit unfair to mention so I simply looked at the last season, as that to me is a better way of looking at the player as he is just now. Which is surely what is important, the indication of most recent form.

Sorry if you disagree with that.

Incidentally 36 in 128 is a better record than 29 in 116. Would you say that the SPL is a particularly better league than the Austrian one.

BdTS
23-07-2011, 17:11
Or rather, you think we are.

Yes, I think we are.

You could discuss my posts rather than reply as if you're marking a Higher English pre-lim, you know. :p

MasterC
23-07-2011, 17:12
And once again, I was not comparing Goodwillie to Jealavic, simply saying that for me Kenny Miller is a better option than Goodwillie right now.

Not for the future, or sell on value, to win the SPL this year

LostSoulForever 2
23-07-2011, 17:15
Yes, I think we are.

You could discuss my posts rather than reply as if you're marking a Higher English pre-lim, you know. :p

You don't know what strikers we are trying to sign, or for how much.